Sustainability from Childhood is InCreativeCo's new series aimed at exploring the relationship between our connection to nature as children and our dedication to our natural world, environmental strategists, mechanical engineers, herbalists and foragers speak their truth to power and together create a collection of imaginative and practical proposals for the action that we need in this moment of climate catastrophe.

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Video Transcript

Eliane Gazzard: When you smell something you can't really be too engaged in the outside world. It's very intimate with ourselves. And it's a nice way to healthily shut it off for a moment.

Gilian Rappaport: Welcome to the sustainability from childhood audio series initiated by Gillian Rapoport and commissioned by In Creative Company. Sustainability from childhood explores the relationship between our connection to nature as children, and our dedication to our natural world. Environmental strategists, mechanical engineers, herbalists and foragers speak their truth to power and together create a collection of imaginative and practical proposals for the action that we need in this moment of climate catastrophe. Join us as we explore what messages about climate possibility do we need to share with our communities now? This question I have around like significant experiences in your life that have influenced your perspective on sustainability, and particularly like in terms of connection with the land, maybe from childhood or some kind of early experience that led you to this path. I'm curious if anything comes to mind.

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Messages About Climate to Share as a Community 🌡️

Eliane Gazzard: Definitely. So I was lucky that I had three sets of grandparents. My mom's parents divorced, and they got remarried like three sets of grandparents and one of them lived in my city, Calgary, Canada, and two of them lived in British Columbia and like mountainous areas, and all three of them had gardens and it was a mixture of edibles and flowers. My grandma that lived in Penticton, she had a whole was mostly edibles. So I would go into the garden and just pull a carrot out, wipe the dirt off and just munch it right there and the flavor of the peas and the carrots was really inspiring and then my grandma lived in Calgary, she had a very extensive Peony garden and her peonies came from France like one of her great, great grandfather's who brought them to Canada.

So they're kind of like an ancestral Peony in my family and it's been passed down and you know, to my mom's generation, and I'd like to harvest the peonies myself, but I've got a very vivid memory of like, hot summer day, kind of succulent peonies covered in ants so my grandma, and I would, you know, shake the ants out and make beautiful bouquets together. So very, very inspired from my grandparents and then my other grandmother, she had an extensive rose garden, so I would just be shoving my face into every Rose of every color and end up with bugs up my nose, and just having a blast in the sun and just hanging out. You know, when I grew up, like in the early 90s, so I had, that's when, you know, TLC, and the Discovery Channel were all about nature and science.

So I would watch National Geographic, religiously, and I had those collection binders too and I like learn about dinosaurs. And, you know, it was unfortunate, like, at the end of every National Geographic, I'd probably start crying because, like, they're endangered, and it's all the humans fault and like, this has to happen. Especially during shark week, I was so traumatized by how awful we were treating the ocean and when I became vegan at like, 18 it was, you know, it was about, you know, being nice to animals, but it was also about the environment and just, like, well, if I can go as long as I can by reducing my how much I cause suffering in the world, I think that's the most important. No, you know, when it was like a political thing too I was very, like, I’m still very punk rock and in heart. You know, and just learning that, you know, at a really young age, I was exposed to, like the queer community and punk rock and really angry people about the situation in the world and that, you know, when I was 11, you know, and I was like, okay you can be angry about the world and have a community about it and like, do something about all of this suffering in the world.

Gilian Rappaport: Can you share a little bit about where you are and what you do?

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All About Elaine Gazzard ✨

Eliane Gazzard: Great. So um, my name is Eliane Gazzard, and I got a company called EGEAU and right now we're focused on making soap. But in the future, we're going to be rolling out some fragrances, candles, everything that goes along with good smells and stuff. So right now I'm in my laboratory signed up for molecules and naturals and I got my fridges running to keep citruses nice and cold. Do a lot of blending at the station. I've got some cool things like analytical balance. So I do most of the making down here and then I package all my products and shipments from another room.

Gilian Rappaport: Thank you. Can you share a little bit about the motivation behind this endeavor?

Eliane Gazzard: Well, just from speaking for myself, personally, I am really inspired by fragrances and like the human connection to nature. I think that when we, you know, smell like stock and smell the flowers that really helps us to humanize ourselves and smells have the ability to transport us to memories or create new memories. So for me, I want to share that experience with people just from myself. I'm really inspired by foraging for ingredients, none of them have made it into my products yet, just because it's, you know, you gotta get good at forging and preserving and tinkering and stuff so it's a whole new research field for me. So since I moved to New York, I didn't realize that you can get walnuts and mulberries, burdock root, just cherry trees around apple, pears. So there's a lot of opportunities to learn from nature. And another part that I like to share with people is actually just the practice of self care in the form of personal hygiene you know, it's, it's the time of day where you're just really taking care of your body. And your body, I think, loves to be, clean, and moisturize and cozy and sometimes we forget about just that basic need for our own body. 

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, that's, I love that message it's such a beautiful idea to be able to take time to be with your body and give yourself something special. Yeah, I'm so curious so was there a particular scent that inspired you to get going? Or, like, how did you get started with this project?

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The Scent that Started it All 😃

Eliane Gazzard: Actually, when I was about 12 years old, my grandma introduced me to tea tree oil, because I had some acne and stuff. I noticed it really worked. It felt cool on my skin like a tingle and I feel really invigorated after sniffing it, even though it's very medicinal, and it's got some like, kind of anvil notes in there. I just loved it and, you know, years later, you know, I got into being vegan. I'm not vegan anymore. But in my vegan years, I'd be at the health food store, just sniffing the essential oils and like, and started to, start a little collection. I remember one day I put on some geranium oil, and some lime oil just kind of on my skin and everyone's was like “wow” it smells good. I was like, “oh thank you.”

just felt so confident after making my own blends and one friend who's just like you gotta write this down, because I was just winging it and improvising. So I started to really write it down and pursue it in like an artistic form around 2011, you know, and then I was like, “wow” I really, really enjoyed this and I would go to, you know, clubs or shows, and people would just be like, “oh, it's you that smells like roses, you've made this whole place smell so good” and I was like, “oh this is really fun.” So I just kept going on with it. Then I started to get into the perfumery side of extracts. For the most part, I avoided the healing benefits of essential oils, because I think that's important to pursue. But for me, it was more about like the art form in and of itself, just how it creates memories and stuff.

Gilian Rappaport: So yeah, it sounded like you said before your friend was like, “you should write this down.” Do you like archiving and writing, keeping notes of what you have, what you're exploring and researching. Is that a part of your practice?

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, so I still have my, I went to the dollar store and got a crappy little notebook. But I still have the original one with the first recipes from 2011 and I'll go through there and you know, and I keep, you know, I have all the little bottles from that time era too and I'll give them a sniff and be like, “wow, I can really expand on this” or “that was really bad.” You know, it's really important, like as a perfumer, or just someone who's blending essential oils or making cosmetics to record every, every last drop and write notes. So you know, because you don't know how certain things are going to interact in the formula. You know what they sound like individually, but once they blend together, you have no idea what's going to happen, and it's really fun. You're like, I don't know what the stinky thing in this beautiful thing are going to do when they come together, but they might make something more beautiful.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, do you find that often but like blending something that's really stinky and blending something that's really sweet comes out being sweeter?

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah. Yeah, sometimes it can be disgusting, but most of the time. It's really interesting how, like, for example, there's a molecule called indole and it's present in jasmine flowers, strawberries, roses, two burrows. It kind of exists in all of these. It exists in nature kind of everywhere, and it's kind of a smell. Some people call it like species it kind of smells like, like a gross two seat oven if you haven't flossed in a while, you know, it's really pungent, but at a really low dose in a bland, it will really help the voluptuousness of flowers, you know, and then that way, as a, someone who's a perfumer or an essential oil, or someone who's making fragrances, you can use less of the flowers, which is more cost effective, sometimes better for the environment, depending on where it's coming from, or how it's extracted. That's kind of why I've just recently incorporated molecules into my blends. It's just to, it’s to offset the taking from nature. So I can, you know, I'll use a little with a, with a whole wood, and it just helps boost each other, helps us florals, and it just kind of takes the impact of the environment a little bit.

Gilian Rappaport: Using less, yeah. Okay, yeah. Can you talk a little bit more about how you think about sustainability and environmental impact with your products?

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How Sustainability and the Environment Impact Products ♻️

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, it's great. So I think sustainability is a relationship with everything from ourselves to individual people to our community, to like how the government treats people how we treat nature and if it's not an even give and take, then it really in the end, it's not sustainable. So I try to take as little as possible and I try to make sure that, you know, the companies I'm supporting, like buying my raw materials from our family owned businesses are very repeatable, high quality, so it costs a little bit more, but that's my way of like, giving back is like, I'm gonna buy this product from this person, turn it into something beautiful and then I can give a nice experience to a customer in the end and I think if we're not evolving with the times, finding planning on certain things, like there's a really precious ingredient called a Garwood and there's actually like, really bad syndicates that will poach these trees and you know, same with sandalwood, if you're not careful where you get your sandalwood or your egawood from, it's really harmful to the environment, and also indigenous communities, you know, people being exploited to harvest those things. So it's now I've kind of strayed away from rosewood sandalwood for now, because they can be, they can be replaced with different naturals and molecules only because of the impact it has on indigenous communities, and social structures, too. So everything, everything I have in EGEAU is a very conscious choice. Like, there's nothing getting by me. As far as you know, environmental, social, and financial impacts. I want to make sure I'm supporting local too.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, is there a way that you communicate about all of this with your products?

Eliane Gazzard: You know, it's kind of, I haven't really highlighted it too much on the physical product, or on my website, it is something I'd like to move forward with, speak out about and also provide content of, you know, maybe there's someone out there like me, who wants to start a company, I think if they knew where to access these materials, they would definitely do it. I think everyone wants to make the right choice. Everyone wants their creature comforts, but they also want to support the right and they want to support the right people and feel good about what they're consuming.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, and more and more so do you feel like you've been building community around these ideas through your products?

Eliane Gazzard: I think so in a nonverbal way. Sometimes, you know, there's a supplier I get my mango, butter, shea butter, cocoa butter from it's a women business in Florida, you know, she goes to Africa and sets up these whole this whole system of extracting the materials and then employs all these women and helps put water into the villages and that's called Three kg. I don't want to be sponsored, but I really want to just be like, yeah, these companies are great and I think from there, I can build a community of just like, “hey, go support these people, they've got great quality and the impact is like, very positive down the line.”

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, like the networks of impact that you're working with through your operation system. So that sort of talking about, like the people you're sourcing from and distributing.

Eliane Gazzard: Exactly, you know, everything from you know, in my actual production, I make sure nothing goes to waste. Everything's recycled. I use you know, paper towels from bamboo owned by a, like a black man and he runs the business. So it's, you know, just make sure I'm supporting black owned businesses alone, just you know, and it's not too hard anymore to do the research. When I first started, you couldn't find much, 12 years ago. 

Gilian Rappaport: So you've been doing this for 12 years.

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, just pushing and pushing I'm just being like, How can I? How can I product that’s not going to, that people love that I'll feel good about that is going to support the bigger world community. 

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah and so in what kinds of setting do you share your offering?

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“Everything is Recycled.” - Eliane Gazzard

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The Platform and Setting ⚙️

Eliane Gazzard: Mostly just a little bit on social media, mostly through World of Mouth right now, it's still pretty small. As far as how many people I can reach on a daily or weekly basis, right now. It's like a lot of friends and friends of friends and one store and I'll go to markets and stuff. 

Gilian Rappaport: So it sounds like you're sourcing your products from all around the world? Or are there more of a local focus? Because I heard you talk about foraging, but then you said you don't really work with forage materials in your products?

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, not as of yet, because with foraging, you have to preserve it properly, you have to dry it properly and so it's kind of like an ongoing learning process, because it's like, “oh, this season of honey suck goes in, and I can make a honeysuckle also, Raj. So I’ll go into the forest, you know, I think it's like, mid June, collect the little flowers, put them in oils, and I'll extract the essence out of the oil that I put them in and if they sit too long, or if they're too wet, it will ferment and be, you know, weird. But, you know, sometimes that's something I can offer like limited edition, weird honeysuckle extract or something. But for example, I'm developing a candle right now that's only American grown, candelila wax beeswax and blueberry wax and I'd like to take it a step further and only feature Canadian or American essential oils in there.

So you know, when I get to a nice development area, then I can release those and that will just be like the, you know, the American grown candle, just straying away from like, soy materials, palm oil, because I can, I can support local businesses that offer essential oils, like based in California or something, but they're also sourcing it from like, bigger distributors, as well. So you know, it's not some huge company like in France, or it all goes to France and the bigger suppliers eventually, but if I can give my money directly to a family or business, it's usually better. 

Gilian Rappaport: It's really beautiful that working with sent and body care, so gentle, and it's interesting hearing you talk about anger, is that like an intentional relationship,

Eliane Gazzard: I think so, you know, recently, we're all we're all kind of, like, if you care, you're kind of angry with how things are right now and, you know, we can't, there's only so much we can do, we can only control ourselves and how we treat others. I think in the end, if you can't treat yourself very well, you won't have the energy or that honesty to be kind to others, you know, so for me, it's like, the bathrooms, my bathrooms, my favorite room kitchen second to that, because I'm just very, I love food, and I love eating. So those are the rooms I go to, to really kind of just go into my own world, and kind of shut out the stresss of how fast climate change is happening, how fast the degradation of the ocean is happening aand you know, the treatment of marginalized communities like it's, it just becomes too much and when you smell something, you can't really be too engaged in the outside world. It's very intimate with ourselves and it's a nice way to healthily shut it off for a moment.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, to be able to, like, really just connect and be present with your body. Is that message a big part of your branding? I'm not so familiar with the messaging around that. But is that something that you feel like resonates with your community?

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Message and Community💬

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, absolutely. You know, the company is called EGEAU. It's just like, my first and last name, and then the French word for water, but comes up being like ego, and we all have one. And, you know, there's different levels of ego, if we can get to the highest levels of our ego, that's kind of where we can do the most good for ourselves, and others, but yeah, I do want that to be that is kind of the main message and the main motivation is that, you know, take care of yourself, you know, love yourself, take care of your body, especially now because, like from the 80s and stuff, you'd have these, you know, heroes like, “oh, I didn't sleep for a week and “I haven't eaten in hours” and “I don't need to drink much water.”

You know, there's like a weird cure illness around depriving your body, especially how inundating society is, you know, with how much we have to work and how little money we make, just keep pushing ourselves and if we can just have like half an hour of our day to just be like, No, I'm feeding myself well, I'm going to make my body comfortable and like this can be really, really beneficial in the long run, like more sustainable for, you know, ourselves and our relationship to the outside world.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, I think that it's really interesting and part of the overall sustainability message is how we care for ourselves, and how that relates to our ability to show up for our communities and the world in better ways that model that care. Is that something that you feel like you learn about from others, or that you are just into it?

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The Root of the Message📥

Eliane Gazzard: Well, it's a combination of both. I've got one friend, and she's just, you know, she's just so inspiring to get a little misty eyed because she gives herself so much to the community and I unfortunately see her like burnout sometimes, and I just want her to take care of herself first. But you know, there's some people out there that sacrifice everything for their community and you see them burn out, you know, I wish I could, you know, be strong like you.

Gilian Rappaport: It is really moving, especially right now. With the state of the world, when we see people who are really giving in that way that's so deep and profound.

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, absolutely.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah

Eliane Gazzard: The most important part is like, well. I'm not strong, like the way she's strong, but I'm strong in my own way. So I'm definitely not, you know, I've really missed to wrestle with like, am I the person to show up to a protest and get beaten up and rested and tear gassed? And, you know, I mean, I have to be honest, like, I'm not, I'm not that person. But for me, the way that I support my community and my friends is by sharing all the knowledge that I've acquired, you know, and I'm like, “oh, hey, like, you know, I do, like, a yearly come forward with me, like, get a hold of all my friends. And, you know, we just get dirty in the bush. And, you know, we just get dirt on your fingers.” And, you know, that's the way that I can really contribute to my communities, just sharing all the knowledge and techniques, and if I can have someone over and show them how to cook for themselves, or make something tastes better, or show someone how to make soap and just be more independent. That's, you know, that's really how I want to contribute to society.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, do you? Can you talk a little more about the experience of sharing, ship sharing, foraging with people in your community and what you've seen their experience be like, for especially people who are new to it.

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Experiences for the New🚕

Eliane Gazzard: The first thing people said was so interesting, because I know I'm like, “oh, there's a tree on 85th street and forest Parkway and at the end of May, it blooms, so we got to go visit this tree over here.” So it's almost like I've got these little friends around the forest. I'm like, “Oh, this is the spot where the burdock grows.” And they're like, “how do you remember this?” You know, it's like, you have to make. Yeah, the first thing people are interested about is like, how they become your friends and you got to go check on tree every year. And you know, there's a really nice Mimosa tree where I go and it was being suffocated by a Kudu Vine, an invasive species. So I, you know, when all the leaves filled during the winter, I just went in and just packed up and got rid of the kudzu around the trees, just so I'm like, “Okay, you're good now next year, you will do better” that one I don't really forage for. I just make these like cute little pink flowers and they smell like honey and you know, and just how much pollen I'll get in my face.

I'll get hives at the end of the day, just cause I'm shoving my face and the 20 different flowers. So you know, their experience is just like realizing how much of a relationship you need to have. You know, I also say like brings water and will water the tree as well. Like we've got a you know, just like a so we don't feel like we're just taking so we're giving back a little bit you know, not taking every walnut you find, maybe tossing it deep into the forest so another walnut tree can grow. You know, and just like how to process them like if you ever touch a black walnut, you need gloves and black shoes and you got to scrub all the steaming holes off of it and then the funnest part is you know, taking an anvil and a ball peen hammer and smashing open the walnuts and it's a lot of work, you know, you get her get bitten by mosquitoes and you got to be really like, chill about everything. 

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, you really have to develop that tougher skin in a way. Yeah, I'm really interested in the Mimosa tree that you're talking about because you're kind of light up about it. Do you ever feel like you have in your imagination or more that you want to share about your relationship with that tree?

Eliane Gazzard: Well, it's so interesting, because I've used a lot of plant extracts and there's a lot of the plants I've never met in person. So when I get to meet one of these trees in person and see its personality, it gives me insight into how, how to work with it as like an extract. So I work with Mimosa extract, and it's kind of like a honey, sweet, powdery kind of extract. So when I, you know, back in Calgary, I never thought I'd see a real mimosa tree in person and get to just show my face to some flowers. The ones in New York are different species than where they are in France. The ones in France are like these beautiful little yellow puff explosions that are like, kind of like hanging on droops. The ones in New York are like, these big, you know, grand little puffs and so they smell basically the same. Mimosa is just like a big species. But for me, it's like, “Oh, I get to actually meet honeysuckle” whereas before, I only drink teas and it's just like meeting the plants in person. It's just really inspiring. Like, I understand your nature. Now, like, I can respect the extract, you know, it's kind of like, you know, when you hunt for your own meat, basically, you don't want to waste anything, because you realize it's such a precious life that you're taking.

Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, thank you so much. Do you feel that the experience you're sharing about connecting with plants and trees, in their natural space in their nature and their ecosystem is and the feeling of your relationship you feel to it? Do you feel that that experience is out of the ordinary?

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Connections That are Out of the Ordinary🦸

Eliane Gazzard: I think it's like, in my group of friends and families, a lot of you know, I've got a couple of friends who are like me, like one of them, she's Polish and grew up forging mushrooms. So you know, she's got a relationship with fungi that is just, it's amazing, you know, she'll go out into the bush and in the Calgary, Alberta kind of area and, you know, just comes back with these big buckets of mushrooms and then I've got another friend who does a lot of things like growing on plants and she's kind of like a medicine woman in her own way. I think it depends on who I associate with.

But a lot of people, especially in New York, they're like, I never thought I'd see so much edible food. But I think like in my immediate circle of friends and family, it's a little bit unique in that sense. But I think once you open the doors for someone, or just be like, “hey, that's, that's, uh, whatever tree can eat the leaves from this time, or this time, and the berries come out from this time at this time.” And, you know, it just opens up people's perception to like, “wow, really, I can get something out of this tree and I can also give something to the tree.” And once it's a work, like once it awakens in someone, but it's kind of like a never ending relationship from there.

Gilian Rappaport: Well, thank you so much. Is there anything else that you want to share about yourself or your practice or, you know, this general topic? Before we close?

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, I think sustainability, you can't just wake up one day and say like, “oh, you know, I do these things. And I'm sustainable.” Now. You really have to be curious and educate yourself. Like every day. It's like, “Oh, I thought this one thing I was doing was sustainable. But it's actually having a negative impact” and like, okay, how can I? How can I work within the system to make it better for the environment and for my community? And how can I help others and it's just like a relationship, it's not really like a place that you are, and it's all about just reevaluating our relationships to each other and to ourselves, nature and community. You know, I think a lot of the issues or the way the government authority systems, you know, there's no sustainability there. As far as like, they just take and take, and you know, that sustainability is just all encompassing. You can’t really avoid it anymore

“Yeah, I think sustainability, you can't just wake up one day and say like, “oh, you know, I do these things. And I'm sustainable.” - Eliane Gazzard

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Gilian Rappaport: Yeah, it's impending. Yeah, no, definitely not necessary. All right. Well, thank you so much. 

Eliane Gazzard: Thank you so much for this opportunity Gilian.

Gilian Rappaport: Oh yeah, I really appreciate you sharing everything that you have and yeah, I'm really curious about your products too. So I'll reach out. 

Eliane Gazzard: Yeah, yeah and, you know, thank you so much for the great questions, too. It's been a really great interview. 

Elaine Gazzard: And when you smell something, you can't really be too engaged in the outside world. It's very intimate with ourselves and it's a nice way to help me shut it off for a moment.

Evan Landau: How, can you turn that into something that's productive? Instead of damaging? Why can't we just take everyone's garbage and turn it to something else? Why can't we have things that people consume? Why can’t we have those be beneficial to the environment as well.

Latoya Ramos: I'm very fascinated by water and the ocean one because of just the ebbs and flows the waves is tranquility that the tranquility that it provides, but also, it's so powerful.

Mackenzie Beth: Yes, we have the capacity to do great harm to the planet. But we also have the same capacity, if not more capacity to do good to create to add value to make a positive impact on our surroundings and so let's learn the skills to actually do that.

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